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[BUG-226599] Bakes on Mesh - right arm and right leg texture slots for universal tattoo type layer #5097

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sl-service-account opened this issue Mar 28, 2019 · 5 comments

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@sl-service-account
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sl-service-account commented Mar 28, 2019

How would you like the feature to work?

Currently we have a left arm and a left foot texture slot in an attempt to provide asymmetry options for baked clothing and tattoos. This won't work. The aux slots could be used, but they could also be used for other things which could potentially break asymmetrical tattoos that use these slots. A dedicated right arm and right leg slot is required on the universal tattoo layer.

Why is this feature important to you? How would it benefit the community?

People have been wanting asymmetry in their avatars for as long as SL has existed. This is a problem with the UV map of the original avatar, with the arm and foot islands not being given their own space, instead doubled up on the UV map, leading to symmetrical arms and feet. (and eyes, incidentally) Even our EARS are asymmetrical. In order to work around this, body creators like myself have provided via applier script a way for tattoo creators to build asymmetrical tattoos by targeting the 2 arms separately with the applier script as decided by the tattoo artist. Now with BOM, we are back to symmetrical arms and feet which is a step backwards in our avatar customisation. To try and work around this, a left arm and left leg texture slot has been provided by LL in the new universal tattoo, but as you can see from the images I have uploaded, this is not an ideal solution. A dedicated right arm and leg slot alongside the left arm and leg slot would provide a workable solution to this problem. As an aside, alpha layers on the main body do not work on attachments set to the left arm bake target as you can see. It would be ideal if they did, but I can work around this with an alpha zone control HUD until this is changed. (note - I have not used the LEFT_ARM bake target in these pictures due to the bug that renders them black. There's an example pic for that too! https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/BUG-226593?filter=-2 )

Description of images

1 - base body set to UPPER BODY bake on mesh target. Left arm attachment set to LEFT ARM bake on mesh target. Overlay of texture from ARM with whatever is baked into the base body arms region
2 - base body now wearing a tattoo layer with texture only on the chest UV area of the map. Neither arm is getting baked textures from this layer now. Only arm texture visible is the LEFT ARM universal layer.
3 - base body wearing tattoo layer with chest only texture, Both arms set to the LEFT ARM BOM texture target.
4 - base body with chest tattoo layer as before, left arm mesh attachment set to LEFT ARM BOM target, the right arm mesh attachment is set to requested RIGHT ARM BOM target
5 - example of why we would request alpha layers affect the universal layer type.

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Original Jira Fields
Field Value
Issue BUG-226599
Summary Bakes on Mesh - right arm and right leg texture slots for universal tattoo type layer
Type New Feature Request
Priority Unset
Status Closed
Resolution Unactionable
Labels bakesonmesh
Reporter Siddean Munro (siddean.munro)
Created at 2019-03-28T04:42:22Z
Updated at 2019-05-31T18:22:08Z
{
  'Build Id': 'unset',
  'Business Unit': ['Platform'],
  'Date of First Response': '2019-04-03T14:01:50.802-0500',
  'How would you like the feature to work?': "Currently we have a left arm and a left foot texture slot in an attempt to provide asymmetry options for baked clothing and tattoos. This won't work. The aux slots *could* be used, but they could also be used for other things which could potentially break asymmetrical tattoos that use these slots. A dedicated right arm and right leg slot is required on the universal tattoo layer.\r\n",
  'Original Reporter': 'Siddean Munro (siddean.munro)',
  'ReOpened Count': 0.0,
  'Severity': 'Unset',
  'Target Viewer Version': 'viewer-development',
  'Why is this feature important to you? How would it benefit the community?': "People have been wanting asymmetry in their avatars for as long as SL has existed. This is a problem with the UV map of the original avatar, with the arm and foot islands not being given their own space, instead doubled up on the UV map, leading to symmetrical arms and feet. (and eyes, incidentally) Even our EARS are asymmetrical. In order to work around this, body creators like myself have provided via applier script a way for tattoo creators to build asymmetrical tattoos by targeting the 2 arms separately with the applier script as decided by the tattoo artist. Now with BOM, we are back to symmetrical arms and feet which is a step backwards in our avatar customisation. To try and work around this, a left arm and left leg texture slot has been provided by LL in the new universal tattoo, but as you can see from the images I have uploaded, this is not an ideal solution. A dedicated right arm and leg slot alongside the left arm and leg slot would provide a workable solution to this problem. As an aside, alpha layers on the main body do not work on attachments set to the left arm bake target as you can see. It would be ideal if they did, but I can work around this with an alpha zone control HUD until this is changed. (note - I have not used the LEFT_ARM bake target in these pictures due to the bug that renders them black. There's an example pic for that too! )",
}
@sl-service-account
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Siddean Munro commented at 2019-03-28T06:49:41Z

Just wanted to add an argument for why this should be added before release - once it's released, people will come up with their own workarounds for the right arm issue, creators will make content for it and standards will start to diverge. I might use appliers. Someone else might use Aux Slot 1, another body maker might use aux slot 2. Adding the right arm and foot slots before release gives us a nice clean path forwards with little open to interpretation

Cheers and thanks for looking into this!

@sl-service-account
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Vir Linden commented at 2019-04-03T19:01:51Z

Sorry, I'm not following what the problem is with the current setup. In your first image, why would be upper body textures get applied to the left arm, if the mesh has been set to use the left arm bake? It should just show the left arm channel in that case.

The textures showing as black is an issue we are aware of and will be looking at.

@sl-service-account
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Siddean Munro commented at 2019-04-04T00:21:19Z

Hi Vir, after your reply I thought maybe I had missed something about how to use the universal system layers and that maybe you mean for us to use the upper body slot and the left arm slot on the universal layer, but the same issue exists with the upper body slot - whatever is on the arm section is baked into both arms. I've looked at all the possibilities and there's just no way to apply a tattoo to the right arm without either baking it to both arms, or using one of the AUX slots and channels which I would rather not do as they are too undefined. The way this will work best if there is a left arm and left leg, right arm and right leg texture slot on the universal applier, and a left arm and left leg, right arm and right leg bakes on mesh channel, and those channels bake transparent textures properly (which will hopefully be working before you release this viewer into the wild) Unless I am completely misunderstanding how the universal tattoos are supposed to work with the black texture obscuring how it's supposed to work. I'm not sure we can realistically ask skin makers to go back and make a universal tattoo with a left arm slot for all their skins to get this to work properly. Otherwise I am happy to just stick to appliers for asymmetrical tattoos with an alpha zone control HUD.

I made a little video for you which will hopefully help explain what the problem is :)  https://youtu.be/O7V6cj1ZDDM Happy to have a skype call at some point if that helps too!

@sl-service-account
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Siddean Munro commented at 2019-04-19T00:57:08Z

I was playing with this again yesterday trying to figure out how it is supposed to work. So the current solution requires me to set my mesh arm to LEFT_ARM, and it requires skinmakers to create universal layers for their skins using LEFT ARM (or redo all their skins onto universal layers altogether) and then it requires customers to make sure they are wearing their skin and their LEFT ARM layer and it requires tattoo makers to do the same thing. I honestly don't think this is feasible. Maybe if the mesh body market were closed systems where no one else was reliant on them working a certain way to maintain their sales or their own products. I especially don't want to ask skinmakers to start updating their products to universal layers, and additionally there are so many legacy skins that will never be updated and just won't work in this scenario. If I go with the currently proposed system I will break several years of content created by other people, and I'm very reluctant to do that :/

A much simpler solution would be something like what I proposed provided the tattoo textures can render transparent over the arms when a person is wearing a base system skin. Then it only requires me to provide a left arm and right arm/left foot and right foot attachment, and a tattoo maker to create a universal tattoo option for those slots.

@sl-service-account
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Kyle Linden commented at 2019-05-31T18:22:09Z

We are not implementing a separate right arm and leg channel.
We are maintaining the course of only adding left arm and leg, plus 3 AUX channels, for a total of 5 new channels in addition to the existing ones.

Thanks!

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